Times you acted like the Truth Exists Man?

I hate to the media literacy man again, but I don't think his belief in rigid, objective morality is why Rorschach isn't supposed to be a role model

What Ozzy did was far worse than anything R did, and a much bigger secret to keep that others really had no way of understanding without him whistleblowing, call him a hypocrite all you want but I dare you to call him wrong nigger. Ozzy was the one killing to satisfy his own ego, jumping to a forgone conclusion that millions must die putting all his efforts into that instead of anything less destructive.

Situational Ethics Man was depicted as the bad guy. Everyone tried to stop him from killing millions of people.
But what he did might have saved the world, and once the crime was done it couldn't be undone.
Stinky Truth Exists Man wanted to sabotage the one good thing that came out of all this purely to satisfy himself.
If you think Truth Exists Man was right you're a brainlet who can't think logically about complex ethical situations. You just mindlessly adhere to a set of principles you don't understand. You're the masses that religion was invented to control because you're incapable of thinking for yourself.

The whole point of the story was that people aren't really capable of making decisions like that. Neither party is really framed as being in the right. It's supposed to be an ethical quandary without a clear answer to make you think about it.

He was right, and you will never be a woman.

Have people read old quotes from Alan Moore. They explain so much.

Killing millions of people was bad.

Don't read Truth Exists Man views on nuking of Japan.

Every character in this story is a deconstruction of a different ethical framework and its limitations:

Comedian: Cynical nihilism, "sure I'm doing horrible things but the world is a bad joke and nothing matters."

Ozymandius: hardcore utilitarianism, the ends justify the means, no matter how horrifying. "I killed millions to save billions."

Dr. Manhattan: detached disassociation, cannot relate to humans anymore therefore their ethical problems don't matter to him "I grow tired of these people etc"

Rorschach: hardcore individualism, things that may do others harm is never okay even in the service of a "greater good"

Night owl: humble straight man to other perspectives / reader insert

I do not care about philosophy and ethics because it gets people nowhere but in the make believe scenario of the world around them, Ozymandias accomplished the most in terms of pulling the world away from the darkness than the other fuck ups in the story

Moore backpedaled because chuds like Rorschach. Originally, he clearly intended Rorschach to be the "good" guy and in the right

Completely wrong and would be oversimplified regardless. Rorschach is happy to do great harm in the pursuit of the greater good and isnt super proportionate about it.
The trouble with Ozy is that his whole plan can just be undone like that, the flaw in utilitarian thinking is that the world isnt a hypothetical on rails like the trolly problem.

ethical philosophy in a nutshell
Anyone who studies the topic realizes that every system is flawed, and there is no perfect answer in ethics. Different systems can help you examine a problem from different angles, but you kinda have to fall back on your instincts in the end.

might have

the book tells us unambiguoualy that the squid attack terrified the world at large such that it instantly brought an end to the burgeoning conflict between Russia and the US. It's heavily implied by Manhattan's ominous last words at the entire Black Freighter story that its not going to last forever, but he at least bought everyone some time and Rorsharch's journal says absolutely nothing that could implicate Veidt with the squid

Thats definitely not true if you read the comic, he has him be very unpleasant and the outlet he likes that he leaks Ozzies plans to was putting out material whitewashing the KKK iirc. Thats not to say he was supposed to be wrong in all regards.

undone just like that

he killed everyone who knew about it, Manhattan killed Rorsharch, and Laurie and Dan won't say anything. Rorsharch's journal, if it gets published, will go in the back pages of an unpopular news rag and only has loose evidence Veidt attacked costumed heroes, whom the public hates

Well it was never certain that nuclear war would break out. He may have killed millions to prevent something that wouldn't have happened anyways.

Why do you think Moore had Rorschach praise Truman at the very start of the series?

Do you think Ozymandias was meant to be a hero?
Or that Rorschach wasn't deliberately written to be sympathetic in a lot of ways?
Except he's extremely flawed and biased in others? Thereby creating a balance and pointing out the source material for his character's issues in a deliberate metanarrative?
Do you think that Moore didn't know what he was writing, and that you're the first person to understand Watchmen?

Ah my bad it cant be undone ‘just like that’ because anyone alive who knows will just definitely not talk or let anything slip I guess. Theres no way anyone could find damning evidence and Veidt had a totally unimpeachable assuredness in all of this before he committed to killing millions.

Granted, absolutely
Yes, that's unironically correct. Manhattan leaves Earth and Dan and Laurie won't say anything. Veidt killed everyone else who knew, including Blake and Moloch, everyone who worked on it, and for the hell of it, his personal body men at the Antarctica base. The coda of the book tells us Rorsharch's journal is the last thing that could possibly undo him, which it won't because itd be the vague accusation of hated murderer Rorsharch against beloved mogul Adrian Veidt

Its hilarious that chuds can't wrap their heads around something as simple as Watchmen

Moore broke incels

He did, he only backtracked when the Soviet Union collapse because that really made what Ozy did look stupid.

this. retards think just because Alan Moore once answered an interview that he was tired of cringey neckbeards running up to him and saying "Rorschach is literally me," that he thinks Rorschach is literally Hitler and that he was endorsing Ozy.

Is it because he smells bad and doesn't get a girlfriend?

There are no Catholic themes

One of the main themes is finding redemption, which is a deeply Catholic theme.

Its meant to be argued about retard, why do you think Rorschach is called that anyway? What did I leave it all in your hands mean?
You will never be a woman btw.

What do you think the significance of his dream is?

kek I do this

It isn't significant.

based

Name literally one LotR villain who was redeemed or who even sought redemption.

Smeagol

You could argue that Mankind is redeemed by helping to destroy the Ring.

Yeah, people tend to not remember Rorschach's journal entries and his obvious self-obsession, or his essays from the boys' home, when they try to interpret him. He had exactly as much arrogance as Adrian. To tell the truth, considering the essay, it increasingly seems more like professional jealousy.

What was the better plan of action to save the world then? Do nothing and just hope it all works out fine? Real intelligent, moron.

Yo, just read Miracleman
Does Moore not like William Marston's Wonder Woman? Felt like Lear's backstory had some stuff meant to denigrate early Wonder Woman comics

surprised he hasn't been on Rogan. he does the vapid yes-and-ing and both-sidesing and rambling anecdotes in a very similar way.

why do you think Rorschach is called that anyway?

Did you notice that he wears a mask that has a Rorschach blot on it?

What did I leave it all in your hands mean?

It means that the editor of the incel magazine leaves it up to Seymour which story to run for the last two pages. Did you even read the comic?

And you would be wrong

They explain how politics-illiterate he is and why Watchmen's references to politics and history are the weakest part of the book. Most people are as ignorant as Moore, though, which is why dumb threads like this persist.

Why

maybe boromir idk

Because there is no indication of that in the books.

There's no other option. The risk of doing nothing is too great. It only worked out in real life because there was no God-like Manhatten, a president who was willing to back down that didn't serve excessive terms with a huge warmongering ego, and the Soviets near to falling apart which eventually did

He should have just asked Dr. Manhattan to make all nukes disappear.

Ozy might have bought some time and delayed a war that might or might not happen and all he had to do was murder millions of innocent people. He isn't a hero and he can't save the world. The only one who could save the world doesn't care. Ozy only really did it to boost his ego like all the other superheroes.

Dr Manhattan could have turned all the missiles into steam in the event of nuclear war

I can only speak to the movies, but they start with Isildur refusing to the destroy the ring which is the original sin. Next we see that the world of men is in decay being led by corrupt leaders. Finally the ring is destroyed with the help of God and the world is redeemed. It's maybe more generically Christian than Catholic but it seems there to me.

he couldn't thougheverbeit. In the movie he says he can't and in the comic there's an estimation by the government that he can't. If he could do that the U.S government would've just asked him to, he was still working for them.

Anon: Believes in reddit spacing and sucking dicks. Not much else.

If Ozy hadn't intentionally blocked Manhattan's futuresight he could have detected nuclear war coming. Might be enough to prevent it, assuming the future is alterable.
I mean if you tell the governments that nuclear war will destroy the world in a month then maybe they rethink the chances of a successful first strike.

Not him, but reddit hasn't worked that way in a long time.

Literally me

Ozy might have bought some time and delayed a war that might or might not happen and all he had to do was murder millions of innocent people.

That's all anyone can ever do though. They fought WW1 and it just bought aome time until WW2, which bought some time until WW3. All sacrificing millions. Someone will eventually push the button. Ozy's plan for an outside enemy to force the world governments to put aside their differences and cooperate fixes all of that. It was the objectively correct plan. The lives lost were negligible compared to those that would die during the inevitable nuclear fire.

You would know, wouldn't you?

He didn't need future sight to know nuclear war was coming. Everyone knew that. If he could've got rid of all the USSR's nukes, the U.S government would've just asked him to do that already.

You know your position is actually so indefensible that you have to pretend the alternative to him pouring time and money into the Squid thing is him instead doing literally nothing. You simply enjoy the grandiosity of the plan just like Ozzie, thats it.

It's like moral conundrums confuse and infuriate these people. In their toddler shit for brains, every author has to be rooting for one "side" and nuance and complex characters don't exist.
Jesus, I hate fat people.

The future is definitively not alterable. If Dr Manhattan sees a nuclear war happen he can't make it unhappen. He could see a war about to happen and then see himself act to prevent it but the point is everything is happening to him at once.
The issue with relying on Manhattan (other than him just not being able to stop it according to the government docs) is that he is very difficult to control which is how he was manipulated by Veidt.

that doesn't make any sense. Ozy fucking up his future sight already made him think nuclear war was coming because he thought his future sight was fucked because of the impending nuclear armageddon.

be me

my words hurt those i love

take a vow of silence

that's all anyone can ever do

I mean they could not kill millions of people. America and Russia are going to play nice for about about five minutes until they start bickering again and then everybody Ozy killed died for nothing. He didnt save anyone, he's just a fucking sperg.

What, you don't like porn?

What happens when no more aliens show up after ten years? Twenty? Fifty?

For me, it's The Question

You are subliterate to the extent you must be baiting or the blackest gorilla nigger monkey ive ever seen. Do you also think he wears that mask because its his name, and its his name because he wears the mask? You really cannot think can you nigger monkey and the line I quoted was the final line do you understand any kind of double meaning?

Maybe they go back to war, but now with lessened tensions and some goodwill built between them.
Hell, it's worth it even if it only bought them 50 years.

lmao you are just as retarded as the snyderfags who think Rorschach did nothing wrong.

This is one of the annoying conventions of Watchmen; Manhattan is omniscient and can more or less disassemble anything effortlessly, except the entirety of Russia's nuclear arsenal

If they destroy the world with nuclear war in 50 years then they definitely would have at the time of the story. So any measure was justified if only to delay it.

For me, it's Mr. A.

Relateable

i hate millennials so much its fucking unreal

Thats not necessarily true, you dont know how peoples mindsets have been changed by Veidts attack it could easily change humanity for the worse despite the peace it brings about. The Squid attack would be pretty traumatising, you know?

0/10

Exactly. I don't know what they're having so much trouble understand. If you knew the world was going to end, and God asked you do you want it to end tomorrow or in 50 years, then of course everyone would say 50 years. Ozy did the right and only thing. The only better option would be to somehow remove nuclear weapons from mankind entirely.

this guy seems REALLY bothered

it attract Midwits due to being a very well known comic the only reason you don't see shitty takes on Corto Maltese or Luther Arkwight is due to no one except comic books nerds knowing what those names are

The war isn't inevitable, it was never inevitable. Ozy only thinks it's inevitable and gaslights Dr. Manhattan into thinking it's inevitable. He possibly delayed a war that MIGHT happen which isn't worth the lives he took. He wanted to be the big hero who sacrificed himself to end the Cold War, but no man has that power. Ozy is just like that pirate, a madman on a raft of dead bodies.

Virtually all western media includes Catholic themes. Cope with this however you must.

fellowship

brotherhood

sacrifice

redemption

easily recognizable good and evil

fighting the plans of a literal Satan

not Catholic.

whoever wrote this meme is a serious brainlet.

Nah, that's stupid. Still not as stupid as sitting around with your thumb up your ass when you could be preventing an obviously nuclear war.

welp, we just magically know armaggedon isn't gonna happen, so may as well do absolutely nothing even though we're the only person in the world who could make a difference and it's a moral imperative to do so. Nope, just send thoughts and prayers and say it'll never happen! But if it does, OOPS!

morally he was right. functionally he wasnt. i too think we need to rid the earth of some pests if we want to preserve it for a while longer. otherwise we're going top speed towards extinction by stupid suicide.

even he wasn't sure what was the right thing to do, but couldn't live with the lie. otherwise he could have lied to BlueManGuy and tried to spread the truth, but he decided to suicide through BlueManGuy

Ozy didn't prevent the war though. If anything he made it worse by turning Dr. Manhattan into a doomer when he fucked with his future sight.

we're the only person in the world who could make a difference

You didn't get Watchmen at all.

literal old jewish woman

"white supremacist ideas"

Why is zionism the one supremacist power structure the left can't be honest about