Why was he such an asshole?

why was he such an asshole?

It's must be very difficult for a very strong independent man, especially of that generation, to suddenly need help and have to impose on your son in this way.

Frasier blew up Eddies home planet.

What’s with this show and all the gay actors pretending to be straight?

He was a cop. He spent years wrangling joggers.

most actors are gay. especially black actors. there are exceptions. but i was shocked to learn that nearly every black actor from reginald vel johnson to paul winfield is a fag

It's called coincidence. Something dumb people can't seem to be able to ignore

Something dumb people can't seem to be able to ignore

mere coincidence

He was for the pilot and flashbacks, other than that Martin is as cool and based as an old timer could possibly be, we should all be so lucky to have father's who are like him.

No coincidence is your trips. Dumb people being dumb is par for the course

The Emperor in the Oblivion remaster looks just like him and I can't unsee it.

He'd been independent and wilful most his life and now he had to not only accept he could no longer care for himself but he had to essentially be the subordinate in someone else's house. He mellows out pretty quickly though. He remains somewhat crotchety but he's pretty affable and easy going. He's right more often than not and still doesn't feel the ned to rub it in his pompous sons' face for the most part.

He's the yin to Frasier's yang, he's so much of an anti-snob that he wraps around to being just as pretentious as his sons

He wasn't an asshole. Life just hit him hard very quickly

wife dead

forced to retire due to being shot

said shooting left him with a permanent limp

relationship with sons very distant

now he has to live with one of them

said sons are fucking bougshie faggots that you can't relate to on any level

He didn't get a sticky for his death

>said sons are fucking bougshie faggots that you can't relate to on any level

It's his fault for never trying when they were kids.

Oh, my sons don't seem to like anything that I like. Better never learn anything about them and leave them to their own devices, I guess. And for good measure, I'll shame them as adults for not liking my interests despite constantly belittling anything they like.

It's his fault for never trying when they were kids.

It was a different time back then. Men went to work, women raised the kids. They took after their mother and by the time they would be old enough to do things together it was too late. Martin even said "I know you boys always took after your mother liking the ballet and those things, but even she could go to a ballgame and have a hot dog once in a while".
And in-universe it was Frasier that refused to related to Martin. Frasier already proved in Boston that he could drink beer and be one of the guys. But in Seattle he left all that behind when he could have gone to the local dive with Martin once a month just like Cheers.

frasier avoided that explicitly because he found himself drinking too much.

frasier avoided that explicitly because he found himself drinking too much.

Not true at all. In Seattle he was constantly drinking fancy wines and sherrys. In Boston the Frasier character was away from Niles (whom he measured himself against in terms of intelligence and culture) so he had less inclination to not participate in the fun goings at the local bar. In Boston Frasier also had Lilith who he viewed as snootier than him and he liked to rub it in her face that he was more down to earth than she was by hanging out with the Cheers gang.
In Seattle the competition nature with Niles was back on and so was Lilith and Cheers.

frasier could hold his drink in fine settings, but he was drinking more and more beer in boston.

I know you boys always took after your mother liking the ballet and those things, but even she could go to a ballgame and have a hot dog once in a while"

But even saying that is acting as if liking hoity-toity stuff is inherently bad, and Hester made up for that flaw by partaking in activities Martin approved of sometimes. It's rooted in the same attitude that made Martin dismiss his sons' interests without ever giving them a chance.

And in-universe it was Frasier that refused to related to Martin.

Yeah, after a lifetime of Martin behaving as if he was ashamed of his sons. Remember the episode where he actually gets pissed off at Niles at that costume party? He reflects on the way he treated the boys and realizes he also needed to be supportive sometimes. I think that's part of the beauty of Frasier: he and his dad clearly had a shit relationship up until he returned to Seattle, and by the end of the series they're closer than ever before.

But even saying that is acting as if liking hoity-toity stuff is inherently bad

No, he's not saying that. Martin loved his wife, even though they had different interests and he was ok with his sons being more like her. He was just pointing out that their mother was willilng to come off her more sophisticated tastes and have a good time with Martin at a baseball game. Something his sons wouldn't do.

It's rooted in the same attitude that made Martin dismiss his sons' interests without ever giving them a chance.

His sons interests are very niche and sophisticated. Not too many working class cops want to go to the ballet. The issue is that Frasier hung out in a working class bar in Boston but for some reason didn't want to do that in Seattle with Martin. Niles would never hang out in a working class bar, so he's not at fault. But Frasier made it seem like he was above Martin when in reality a few years earlier he was in Cheers frequently.

Yeah, after a lifetime of Martin behaving as if he was ashamed of his sons.

Maybe so. But the idea of Martin going to the ballet was nonsense. But Frasier going to a bar with Martin is very much practical given what he did in Boston.

I think that's part of the beauty of Frasier: he and his dad clearly had a shit relationship up until he returned to Seattle, and by the end of the series they're closer than ever before.

I completely agree.

He also got cucked by the dead wife

Frasier and Picard would constantly try to outsnob each other while Martin and Worf silently prayed for death.

Not to mention a dead wife

If you were on a famous sitcom playing a character people loved and mods denied you a sticky when you died, you'd be an asshole too.

My headcanon for why Frasier was more down to earth in Cheers was that Niles brought out all his worst tendencies. Niles was probably also less neurotic before Frasier and Daphne moved to town.

The entire episode is just them trying to outsnob them and then Picard decides he's lost it and Fraiser is just too stubborn to admit defeat. He takes some shore leave and Fraise goes to Ten Forward and has a chat with Gainan who pours him a Bordeaux vintage and Fraiser says its the best wine he's ever had asks what it is.

Hmm? Oh that its Chaeteu Picard. As i understand it, the captain runs the vineyard as a hobby. Do you have any hobbies Dr Crane?

:|

Was that after Lilith or Diane left him though?

he and his dad clearly had a shit relationship up until he returned to Seattle, and by the end of the series they're closer than ever before.

I love their love later in the series, like them crying for being too mean pretending to be Jewish or Fraiser and him dying of laughter together at all the Lilith jokes he makes